Choosing a yeshiva for your children has never been more complicated, especially in the NY area. Moshe asked a question, I answered and then he responded. Please read the thread below:
Is there a website that lists all of the yeshivas and their affiliations?
May 14, 2008 7:25 PM
ProfK said...
Moshe,I did some research and I can't locate one place that would have a list of all "schools of Jewish education." The Wikipedia has a list of "yeshivas" both pre and post WWII, but those are strictly schools for males. And they say they need more input because the list is incomplete. Torah U'Mesorah has a list of the schools affiliated with them, but not of the others.
May 15, 2008 9:29 AM
Moshe said...
Well then, let's make one. How about yeshivareview.com? Anyone got a better name? I'll pay for the domain and add it to my account.
May 15, 2008 10:04 AM
ProfK said...
Moshe,Brilliant idea! Would you mind if I posted this idea separately? Some good ideas might come up. Personally I'm wondering if calling it "yeshiva" might not confuse some people who think of yeshivas as something for boys, not boys and girls. I could be wrong.
May 15, 2008 10:09 AM
Okay readers, Moshe has volunteered to sponsor a site that would give parents the information they needed about all the yeshivas out there. No more just sitting around and complaining that "someone" needs to do something. Yes, we need your input. And it wouldn't hurt if someone with some website design knowledge would volunteer a little time and expertise.
My own suggestion as to organization: For NYC, divide the listings by borough and in each borough perhaps by area sections. Ditto for the surrounding areas of NYC, like Long Island or Westchester. And we need to include the "out of town" yeshivas as well--NJ is still out of town. Maybe divided by county or by city. And if we are really going to be all inclusive, a listing for every state that has yeshivas, with the cities of location. (Tels is still right outside of Cleveland you know.)
Moshe, thank you! Something we can do that will have practical applications.
Readers, what do you think?
40 comments:
If this is for real, count me in. I think it's a great idea. I think that it would be very useful to have the number of students in the school, how many classes per grade, how many students on average in a class. Also, what is tuition (a parent in that school should be able to give what the school is asking and whether they are generous or not in tuition reductions.) Certainly need the principal's name(s). Need the general religious outlook. Do they offer any extra services?
Name I'm not so sure of. I think that yeshivareview like ProfK said might get people thinking of only boys schools or maybe would not think that day schools or maybe more modern schools were included. Maybe frumschoolreview?
Yasher koach to Moshe for putting his money where most of our mouths have been.
If the website exists (and provides good information), it will be publicized through word of mouth. Review sounds more subjective that what you may be looking for - maybe YeshivaList?
How about jewishschools.com? That's gender-neutral and conveys what the website is--an informational center about Jewish schools.
Unfortunately, Stern college being the only Jewish school I've attended in the NY area, I don't think I'd be of much help in providing information, but I think it's a fantastic idea.
A list sounds to me like it would just put the names down. How about Jewishschoolcatalog.com? A catalog usually gives descriptive information about the items in the catalog. And this is a really great idea!
Who decides what is the "truth" about an institution?
The average decides the truth. Well, not average as that can get screwed up by a few people, average taken from data minus the ends of the curve. Forgot what it's called. Mean? Median?
Let's not make the name too long.
That could get tricky as perception does not always equal reality.
Listen, I think this is a worth while idea and would be more than willing to provide info on the places that I have knowledge of.
I'm just a little concerned as to who holds the final say as to what will be the info about any one place.
Like I said, everyone. And I prefer firsthand knowledge, not my friend or my friend's friend.
For now, I'm gonna add a subdomain to my site, jewishschools.ookamikun.com and gonna start adding schools. Prob will be available in the afternoon.
I would imagine that most of the information would be fairly neutral--you can't argue numbers. Either the school has 15 children per class or it has 25. Where the arguments are going to come is on how to classify the school religiously. First, some schools already self-classify. For those who don't maybe we will need to provide some "details" that might indicate to future parents some idea about the religiosity. Maybe naming the high schools where an elementary school's graduates go? Maybe naming the schools where the sisters of students in the boys schools go or vice versa? Maybe trying to determine how many of the high school kids go on to college and which one? Just a few thoughts. And to answer G's concern, we can include that some parents see the school as X and some as Y, making sure to indicate that it is only one parent's opinion. Any comments section, if included, would have the disclaimer that the comments represent the opinion of parents/students.
Sounds great to me.
Believe it or not, I actually had this idea about a year and a half ago and actually registered yeshivareview.com. At the time, however, I didn't follow up on it and let the domain expire.
I'm also willing to do this if anyone wants to help.
The Wolf
So let's collaborate. Can you do design at all?
I'm gonna be doing it in PHP and MySQL and maybe AJAX. I already have an alumni site with AJAX, alumni.ookamikun.com
Do you know PHP? I'm ColdFusion hacker, learned a little PHP so that I can make my own site. ColdFusion hosting is mad expensive.
Not really. I know SQL and some basic HTML. I started picking up PHP a while ago, but I never seriously persued it.
Nonetheless, I'm always willing to learn.
sux, can never find a designer...
well, the domain is up.
added a few schools. didn't do styling or details page yet.
what do you know and what can you do?
Rabbi Horowitz has the beginnings of such a site set up already
It seems to have lots of schools, but few details about any of them. It might be worth it to add details to his site instead.
http://www.rabbihorowitz.com/PYes/Schools.cfm?SID=76
Saw it.
The interface is horrible and like you said, no details. The data is also wrong in some places. Worst part though, narrow, no search, no filter, no letter index, etc.
The site also doesn't show up on google and doesn't have a separate domain.
How about a wiki site? That way its really a collaborative effort.
same problem, no filter, no search, and very limited functionality.
and who says my site is not collaborative.
I think it's a great idea and will help to the best of my ability.
Mark
Moshe, it needs "all" in addition to "boys", "girls", and "mixed".
Here are some lists of many Florida schools -
http://privateschool.about.com/cs/schoolsfl1/l/bljewish_fl.htm
http://www.kosherdelight.com/FloridaJewishSchools.shtml
http://www.privateschoolreview.com/religiousSelection/typeReli/17/stateid/FL
Kol HaKavod LeMoshe!!!
Mark
Why all? People look for specific, not all.
Privateschoolreview is a pretty cool site, too bad tuition not listed.
thanks
Moshe,
Checked out the private school review site and looked specifically at the Staten Island schools, just so I could see how up to date the list is. First, it didn't list the day school that has been here for "only" about 45 years. Listed a high school that closed here about 3 or 4 years ago. Didn't list two other boys yeshivas that are based here in Willowbrook. Might be a good place to start from but lots of checking going to be needed.
that's teh problem wit all these sites, missing and outdated info.
Didn't read all the comments, but here's my take:
Sounds like a fine idea. But a few precautions will need to be taken:
1. I agree with the "jewish schools" idea -- gender neutral and connotes a list, whereas "review" is likely to invite criticism.
2. It would need a skillful editor to objectify and properly frame the descriptions so that they don't bear judgemental connotations.
The jewish week published a directory (for LI, not sure of the other areas) and it lists many of the school in it. They also include a small blurb about the school. I can probably come up with many of the LI schools, if you would like. Let me know.
I think the directory is called "Directions" and is published in either the summer or around the Yomim Noraim.
Does it say whether the school is RW, MO or LW? Tuition?
It would be great to get each schools rules/bans.
This is a great idea and I'm happy to help however I can. I'm posting a link to encourage other people to get in on the conversation, and will chime in with a few of my own brilliant ideas later. ( ;
Let me know if/when this pertains to non-NY institutions and/or places in E"Y.
I am familiar with or can find poeple familiar with most of the schools in those areas.
Moshe,
If someone wants to send you the information directly what email address should they send to?
Though this is primarily for the psycho frummie NY where you can't walk outside or keep your own minchagim, I'll add any Jewish school to the list.
The email, jewishschools@ookamikun.com, is on the site, jewishschools.ookamikun.com
I do not mean to compete... I hope this wont be taken that way. But your site seems to put the burden and responsibility (and editorial/veto rights) on one person. (Unless your planning on taking it to another level of interactivity)
I very quickly slopped this together on a wiki site. It allows everyone to enter their own information, and of course has history and revision like any wiki
http://jewishschools.wetpaint.com/
I am not a programmer or even much of a computer geek, so I dont have any bells and whistles like sorting yet, but it must be possible because I have seen it on many sites.
You need to log in to edit, but anyone can do that. Any thoughts?
Dunno on what wiki site you've seen filters and search by specific column...
And the last thing I want is for school administration to go and edit anything that wasn't verified by parents and students.
But your site, only allows you to add information, and there is no discussion..
Are those things in the works for your site, will you have some sort of forum, and some way for someone to enter the information without emailing it to you?
Moshe, I have seen the column sort on Wikipedia
Moshe,
Directions doesn't give the hashkafah or tuition but does give demographics, eg all boys, coed, etc. Peolple can probably reason it out for themselves. Another helpful thing might be the schools web-site.
Re: tuition I'm leery of posting that as endowments and other particulars can greatly impact that. Also how the finance commity operates is open to misperceptions. Ex: i've heard complaint about my kids schools committee, why because they won't give to peple who send to camp, lease a new car every other year and make other questionable financle decissions. Those who are struggling do get help but all you hear is the complaining from those who think it is their right.
Have a good shabbat.
It's been one day! Are you one of those people who would look at a construction site and say, "wow, this house sucks! How are you supposed to live there in the winter?!"
I'd prefer email because when people see a form with 30 fields, they don't want to fill it out.
Don't know if I want to build the forum myself, maybe will install one or use an external one.
great schools and privateschoolreview lists whether male or female. How about schedule? Hours per week is confusing because how many hours on Friday and Sunday?
People can't figure out how right wing a school is, that's the point.
Tuition shows how obnoxious a school is. Mirrer yeshiva charges $800 for kindergarten! Maybe some way to find out tuition range or how much people can expect to pay on average.
Moshe,
I really didnt mean it that way.
I have only used the ready made stuff... so I dont know what it takes to start from scratch.
Could you tell us what your plans are for the interactivity of the site. Would everything have to be run through the administrator of the site? Could people just put in the information they have, and let others who have more info add it at a later time.
I my ideal website would have
-A list all the schools with the basic info which anyone could enter as much info as they have, all the puclic info.
-A place for parents to write about unwritten rules, which are the brother sister schools, and some info about the attitude toward things like secular education... so long as there are 'moderators' who will keep things civil.
-And a place for the school itself (if they cared to) to post more details that the public may not have available, ie the student to teacher ratios and there should be an 'official' place for them to write what they say are their hashkafa.
I too would love to help with the content of such a site, and I think that the people here who offered to help are NOT intimidated by many fields.
Perhaps a newcomer to the site might, but hopefully with the help of all the people who think this a great idea the basic info for the list will be populated in no time at all!
people can put in info.
for now, I'd prefer the info emailed to me as it saves me work.
you do understand that I have access to the database and can alter or delete anything at will so it makes no difference whether info is emailed to me or there's a form for it.
I downloaded a forum package and in the process of installing it.
Link will be on main page, maybe later today.
The unwritten and written rules is why I want to make this site so those are very important.
We're happy to help out with the list of Jewish schools. www.ModernMitzvah.com is a nationwide directory for parents planning their child's bar/bat mitzvah. There's tons of free planning tools, a chat room, and a free website builder for the kids. Also, there's a category for educational services and camps. I hope you find this interesting.
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